How are you doing, Murray?
Murray Lightburn: Good, you?
Good. Where are you at today?
I'm lying on my bed. It's awesome.
You're at home, then, huh?
Uh. Uh, yes.
(Laughs) Long answer, I guess.
Yeah, well, it's weird because even [guitarist Patrick] Krief our guitar player was just saying he's been feeling really like, he'd be waking up and not realizing where he is. And it's a total classic thing.
So you guys just got back from Australia, right?
Yeah.
How did that go?
Amazing. It was fantastic.
Had you guys ever toured there before?
No. Never been. And actually, it was great. I had such a fuckin' blast.
So who in the band had the worst fake Australian accent?
Nobody even tried. I did meet some really nice people in Brisbane… was it Brisbane? No, Sydney. And they were really. Oh, where the fuck was it? Which place was that record store? Got into Sydney, eh, shit. I think it was Brisbane. Anyway, it was one of those. And we were doing and in-store [performance] and I met up with these guys and I was trying to learn the accent. But it was pretty tough, though. It was kind of weird, there's a bit of a twang.
So how does it feel for you guys to be getting all the good press lately, the Top 10 Artists to Watch in Rolling Stone and all that kind of stuff?
Um, you know, it's nice, you know, I won't lie to you. It's great, you know. It feels like the work that we've put in and the love that we've put in is coming back, you know? That being said, there's still tons of people who won't even give us the time of day, there's still tons of people who hate us and, you know, say mean and nasty things and hurt my feelings … but for some reason because I'm so sensitive, sometimes those things temporarily overshadow all the great things that are happening. And sometimes our manager has to slap me in the face and say, 'What the fuck is wrong with you?'.
Why do you think the new album ("No Cities Left") has struck so many critics? Why does everybody love it?
I don't know. I really really really really don't know. I mean, we put a lot into what we do, so I hope that it's recognized, you know, that it's not just some bullshit record like most records that come out, you know what I mean? There's so many shit records out there.
I'm with you on that.
Yeah, I mean obviously you must get a lot of them on your desk. Holy moly, like, I've only recently started listening to music again, and I'm being really selective over what I'm picking up. It's like painful sometimes. Should I get this or should I get that, you know? And there's so many good records out there that I need to get, you know, like right now I'm kind of in a Miles Davis phase, but I'm still not sure how great he really was. But I just picked up "Sketches of Spain" and "Kind of Blue," two records that I've never listened to. And, you know, talking to the guy at the record store I was like, 'I could get "Bitches Brew" but I don't think I'm ready for "Bitches Brew".' you know? So he's like saying, 'Yeah, if you haven't heard these records, you're not ready for "Bitches Brew".'
I don't know. The things that I look for in music – the things that we all look for in music in the band – I think we try to bring it into what we're doing in the Dears, you know? So it's not like we're trying to make critics' choice records, but I think we're pretty strong critics ourselves of music. So if something's shit it's not going to end up on a Dears record. But that being said, some people still call a Dears record shit. (Laughs).
I actually haven't listened to any of the older albums. Is this one any different, or was it just kind of luck this time that it hit at the right time?
Well, I think if our first record came out in, you know, 'cause our first album never really got a proper release anywhere outside of Canada. So I think when we're able to remix/remaster the first album for some anniversary (laughs) reissue vibe, if we're able to find a distributor for that album, I think people will… When it came out in Canada, I wish it came out everywhere else because I think a lot of people might have dug it, because it's really gritty. I think "No Cities Left" is a little glossier – in a way – even though it's still kind of gritty. So we're slowly getting glossier and glossier. (Laughs)
The band started in '96, did you ever think at times about quitting, because you didn't quite make it as far as you have now? Or did that not even pop into your head?
To be honest with you…
I mean also taking into the fact that you were the only guy to be steady in the band and everything.
Yeah, but you know, it's weird because the time has passes so quickly it seems, you know? Being in this band is like living in some kind of … I don't know. Time seems to … I mean, we just came off of two months of touring and – a little more than that actually – but, we just came off of these tours and it feels as if time completely stood still. So when you're busy doing stuff… I mean, I couldn't even remember what day jobs I had at the beginning.
When we put out our first album, I quit my day job and never looked back. It was a decision that I had to make if I wanted to be serious about this. I got very serious about making music when we were making that album. And it got to a point where… it was pretty funny, because, I basically felt like I had to quit my job because we were having this meeting in the conference room at my job at the time, it was just after our first album came out and next thing you know we're in the fucking newspaper. The daily, like the big daily newspaper. So at the end of the meeting my boss busts out the daily and says, 'Anyway, it's the last business meeting, our buddy here Murray is famous, blah blah blah' (laughs). I was so embarrassed! Being in a band was like my secret life. I was outted. It's like a Clark Kent slash Superman kind of thing. It's like worlds completely colliding. 'Cause I never wanted to see any of these people come to any gig, you know what I mean? It's like totally separate worlds. These are the kind of people where when I talk to them at work, I'm not talking about music or art or anything. I'm talking about fuckin' drywall or some shit, you know what I mean? (Laughs).
What kind of job was it?
I was a clerk in an office. I'd like get photocopies made, send faxes, provided people with staples.
So did any of those people come to see you?
I don't recall any of them coming. It was pretty funny. So I just said 'Fuck this, I have to get out of here.' So I got out of there. They though I was going out to pursue fame and fortune. I guess I don't know, whether or not they even remember me is another thing.
What's it like to be a black guy in rock 'n' roll?
I'll be honest with you. It's really tough because I think there's a lot of white folks who think that black people have no place in Rock 'n' Roll, subconsciously. It's not a conscious racism at all. It's a totally subconscious thing. They're put off by a dude like me being in a position that I am – not just in a rock band – but, you know, if I was sitting in the back, you know, just the black guy at the back, nobody really knew my name or whatever, it'd be another story. But I'm not. I'm singing the songs and writing the songs and all that shit and I think sometimes that puts people off a little bit, they call me arrogant on stage and shit like that, and I'm like, 'Wow. Where are they getting this from?' It's weird. It's sad, and I don't want to believe it, but I know it's there. I have to deal with it all the time. It's just in society, certain white folks think that black folks have one place, and that is beneath them. And if the feel as if in any way that that person is above them then they try and take 'em down. I don't want to believe that, but it happens all the time. I have to deal with it sometimes. And it's sad. It's really fuckin' sad, because I'm not here to say I'm above or beneath anyone. I'm just here just being me. And it's sad that people have the insecurities and whatever within themselves. If I bring out insecurities in white folks, then that's their fuckin' problem.
Why do you think there are so few black leading men like you and Lenny Kravitz, and the handful there have been?
You know, this one guy, he made this movie called "Afropunk" – I can't remember his name, his name is James something-or-other [Spooner] – and we were together, I remember, and one thing he said that was really interesting was that he predicts in 10, 20 years' time that blacks would be run out of hip-hop and that they'd be moving on to something else. And I can see what he's talking about, because back in the day, when you think about where Rock 'n' Roll really came from, sure it was made famous, again, by white people, same thing with jazz. Jazz was totally underground until Benny Goodman happened. Again, it's like that situation. So it's like me coming back and saying, 'Hey, you know, we still like to rock.' (Laughs) Is that so surprising?
Do you think maybe it's just a culture thing where it's looked down upon in black communities if you like rock?
It's funny because when I was in high school, I had really tough time fitting in. Because, you know, the black kids thought I was trying to be too white. The white kids, well, looked at me and said, "Well, you're not white, so you can't be one of us." (Laughs) So I was one of nothing. So it was a really strange way to grow up. And I still feel it now with all the different cliques and whatever, you know, I'm like the only black dude around for miles. When I play shows I'm like the only black person in the room. Back when we were just on our last tour, I'd say it was a good week and a half before I finally saw a black person at one point. It was really astounding. But it's not a big deal. I don't feel weird about it. It's been like that my whole life. It's weird because I wish that I could see more color out there when I look out in the crowd. Because then I know we're really doing something, you know?
You kind of feel like a role model then?
Yeah, because I think to be honest with you, I don't identify myself as a black person, or anything like that. I know I'm black, and I'm not ashamed of it. It's just a part of my stats, you know? But, you know, the whole identity part of it, you know, I mean, I struggle all the time with dealing with where I come from, and all that shit. But at the same time, I can't give a shit. What I have to deal with is who I am now and who I want to be. And who I want to be is something that defies all that shit. I think if humankind can really evolve past looking at people from that perspective, then we're really getting somewhere. But unfortunately, that's just not what's happening, you know?
Do you have any connection to Chicago, or anyone in the band?
No, but I like Chicago. The last time I was there I liked it a lot, and I wish I could spend more time there.
What's your favorite part about the city? Have you been to any places that you like?
Well I haven't been able to do a proper sightseeing vibe because the nature of touring is you're in, you're out, next city. Next. So, I wish I could hang out properly. We've met some really cool people there and there are some really cool music fans there, which is really nice. There are like real music fans. They're not at a show to be cool or to be seen at a show. The people that we met at our last show were all really keen, and a lot of them had never seen us. It was just nice to have conversations with people who want to talk about other music they enjoy and stuff like that. So it's a good music town, I think.
Since you write all the songs, how much of the song is completed when you bring it into the band? Have you tracked it out yourself and everything like that?
Well, I do a fair amount of work. Sometimes I just go nuts. The thing is I'm not really into that. I think I just do it out of exploring where things can go. But ultimately when we get together as a band and they hear the demos that I make, we're still going to take it up a huge notch. And I never know what beat George might come up with. So laying down a beat sometimes is like a waste of time. But sometimes we'll be at a soundcheck and I'll just start playing a riff and George will play a beat and I'll say, 'That's a great beat,' and I'll use it. Then I'll make a demo based on that beat. So, as people will do things or come up with ideas and they'll wind up on demos that I'm making, 'cause I'm just taking a little piece of them and putting it in there.
Well, thanks again for your time. I look forward to seeing you when you come up this way.
Awesome man. Good talking to you.
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